Council Meeting

Thank you, Sarah.

Good evening, View Royal.

Welcome to the council meeting for Tuesday, November 5th, 2024.

Start with a territorial acknowledgement and that we recognize the La Kongwin speaking people known today as the Esquimalt Nation and the Songheese Nation and that their historic connections to these lands continue to this day.

I think Sarah briefed everybody in the room, but I know that many of you are here for likely Gibraltar Bay.

So looking forward to the presentation and the questions afterwards.

And just to note that if you scan the code and you're calling from home, you scan the code on the main screen and want to participate because of a change in Microsoft Teams.

You can't call in anymore, but you can chat in your question, and Carl will read them during public participation or the question period times.

So for public participation, you have five minutes for each speaker, and it must be related to an item on the agenda.

And question period is open to any question limited to two minutes for each speaker, and you will be timed.

The meeting will be recorded.

By participating in this webcast, you are consenting to being recorded, and the recording will be available on the town's website for future access.

May I get in a motion to approve the agenda, please?

Moved by Councillor Brown.

Second.

Seconded by Councilor Rogers.

And can I get a motion to adopt the minutes of uh uh the last minutes for October 15th, 2024, please.

Move adoption.

Moved by Councillor Rogers, seconded by Councilor Brown.

All those in favor.

Any opposed?

Seeing none opposed, motion carries.

And uh mayor's report.

Um, so I know this is a busy evening.

Uh many people are glued to watching the American um uh election uh that is occurring this evening, and certainly since our uh last time up, we've had a provincial election with results still being um uh tabulated, but it looks like uh the NDP government's going to uh form it.

Um we are hoping that perhaps this time around they're a little bit more engaging to uh municipalities and hearing from their public.

Um uh councillor Brown will be uh taking over duties for the Squamalt Cenotaph for Remembrance Day.

Is for the first time I'm going to participate as a passenger and they fly over for um for View Royal and uh the islands and whatnot.

First time in a very small plane in a very long time since I was in uniform.

So I'm looking forward to that.

Uh so this next item I think is brings us down to petitions and delegations.

So I would invite um the uh Gibraltar Bay, Ms.

McGyver, uh to uh present.

And I think Sarah's giving you the rundown.

Thank you.

Oh, good evening, um mayor and counselors, um, fellow V Royal people and staff.

Um, thank you for the opportunity to speak to you tonight about the Gibraltar Bay Gazebo Project.

So I'm on the presentation agenda slide.

So the next slide, please.

So what we want to cover tonight is um a little bit of background about the gazebo, the community involvement we feel that is there at uh Gibraltar Bay Gazebo, um, the vandalism that's recently occurred, the Town of U Royal support that we've had so far, and that we hope to corner further.

Talk to you a little bit about the gazebo committee and how that evolved.

Talk to you about the quotes that we received, the town hall meeting that we had with our residents, and the next steps that we see going forward, and the future and the safety of the site.

So a little bit about the background of the gazebo.

So Gibraltar Bay, as you know, is a seaside bare land strata, and there's 72 homes there now, and all the lots are complete.

So we're there's no longer any more building going on.

The gazebo was built by the developer in approximately early 2000s and made from cedar.

There was a rock pathway.

So at the same time or a little bit in two sections, there was a pathway and a stairway leading to the gazebo that was built jointly by the town of View Royal and the Gibraltar Bay strata.

And there was a 50% cost sharing agreement at that time.

So the first section was the stairs to from Palmer, the stairs to the top, and that was a $25,000 cost item.

And the second phase was from that where that left off down to the actual gazebo, which was a $50,000 cost.

So the gazebo area is very much loved by all the residents in View Royal, not just the residents of Gibraltar Bay.

When we walk down there, you see many people that you know aren't residents, and you know we have chit chat people up.

It just seems to be a great destination for people out walking, going looking for a great view of the water.

Next slide, please.

So just some community involvement that we've had has been a couple of posts on Facebook, and there has been you know lots of comments.

People want to know what's going on and why is why is the signage up there, what's going on, what's happened.

So there's been some engagement probably for a couple of months back and forth on those groups.

And I've found some interesting facts out in reading some of the comments.

There's been an engagement at the gazebo.

There's been a wedding at the gazebo.

There's been lots of lots of people go there to meet there.

It's a great meeting spot.

I know personally for myself, we moved uh to View Royal in 2014.

My daughter lived in Esquimalt for quite a number of years, and she said, I'm gonna drive you to this little spot that's just beautiful, this beautiful view.

So she took us along View Royal Avenue and we walked through the posts and went up and looked out at the gazebo.

Lo and behold, we ended up buying a home there.

And we had looked everywhere Bear Mountain, out in the peninsula, everywhere.

But we decided, no, this is a good spot.

So um, next slide, please.

So unfortunately, we uh in 2022, around that time, we started to see some vandalism happening.

Um, I think two or three times some of the pickets were kicked out or punched out, however, they let them out on the railing that surrounded the gazebo.

So they were repaired a couple of times and patched things up, and then it kept happening.

Um, we found evidence of drugs, heavy-duty drugs, so some crack pipes and things like that.

Um, lots of fooze, glass, um condoms, uh, all kinds of things.

So, you know, people were getting concerned that it's being used possibly by groups that we're not wanting to encourage.

So uh we we talked about it a lot at our strata meetings of what we could do, and we talked about lighting, um, signage, and we did some of those things, and it just continued to happen continued to happen so currently it's there's a big sign there please don't enter because it's literally not safe anymore there's uh the structure is quite weak because the pickets have all been kicked out so in discussions with the residents um at our AGM many of the residents felt that just the the actual structure itself was encouraging for people to kind of be hidden away to do activities that were not not what we would like to see down there.

So, like I say, due to the damage, the structure is just no longer stable and it and it really is a hazard which concerns us, especially because families would take young kids down there, and you know, we don't want anybody going over the edge.

So we've and of course we can't stop people from going, but we've we've done our best.

But we are very concerned about liability issues there.

Um the structure.

So a couple of times staff from the from View Royal has come down and kind of agreed it's it's pretty wobbly and dangerous and not really structurally sound anymore.

Plus, it was built 24, 20, 23, 24 years ago, and it it's probably not up to code any longer.

So that that's a concern.

Uh next slide is just some images of the vandalism and what we've tried to do to mitigate it.

Next slide.

The $8,000.

So subsequent to that, Gibraltar Bay held their annual general meeting on May 21st, and a resolution to refurbish the gazebo for an estimated cost at 17,500 was defeated.

Residents wanted more information and more options.

So they didn't like the option to just put that money into it and to have it the same type of structure as is there now.

So there was some concerns.

And so what came out of that is we decided that we would form a separate gazebo committee and come up.

So our mandate was to come up with other options that might work.

So we we did that.

So next slide.

So the Gazebo committee had about 10 residents that represented the strata.

So we were a vibrant group, most of some of who are here tonight.

And we had uh we had on site meetings because it was beautiful weather in the summer.

Great place to have a meeting.

And so we had lots of discussion about what do we think residents want, what would be the best for our group and for the community as a whole.

And we had a number of discussions about the community as a whole because it's important to all of us, and many of us had lived outside of Gibraltar Bay.

So becoming part of Gibraltar Bay didn't negate the feeling that they wanted to be part of the bigger community of Du Royal.

See what else can I tell you.

So the committee had three rock contractors quote on a variety of options and one general contractor quote on replacing the structure with a new cedar gazebo.

I've got some quotes to show you on the next slide.

And this did not include the foundation cost, which could easily be another 10 to 12,000.

So then as a committee, the gazebo committee came back and we sat with all our options, and we actually had a little vote on what everybody in the gazebo committee felt would be the best option, and we came up with option number one, which would be a roofless cement and rock structure in the same footprint as the existing gazebo.

So the existing gazebo is about it's a hexagon shape, so it's roughly 12 by 12, so it'll be 150 square feet approximately, so quite small.

But that's perfect for us there.

So what we're thinking is of that same footprint with uh cement and the similar flagstone that would match the stairway and the walkway down, and then middle railing around the new structure for safety.

Next slide, please.

So that was the number one option.

So we had three options that we went over as a committee, and the number one was the one that I've just talked to you about.

Number two was kind of upland from the gazebo where there's now a platform with a bench.

So it would be to expand that into a bigger seating area.

And so that ended up being more costly actually at 64,411.

And the third option was to do both option one and option two, which would have been $100 and some thousand dollars.

And we all said that was too much money to spend at this time, and discussed that we could always do additional uh work after the fact.

You could do one area and then you could do another area at a later date.

Um, on my quotation and estimate slide, you can see where I've got also the general contractors quote at uh my eyes here 39,73595, which didn't include the provision for the foundation.

So, next slide.

So, from all of those quotes and all of that information we gathered, uh we wanted to report back to the actual Gibraltar Bay residents.

So we held a town hall meeting on September 26th at the Scottish Cultural Center, and it was only for Gibraltar Bay residents and to ask questions from us and get further information.

And so we had approximately 30 residents attend the meeting, and their concerns were mostly about the cost of the options.

So there is in our depreciation report, approximately, Reg, can you help me on this one?

$15,000 allotted for replacement of the gazebo.

And other than that, any other monies would have to come from a special assessment if we were to cover all of those costs.

Residents aren't interested in a special assessment or in paying a lot of extra cost.

So their hope is that we could get Town of View Royal on board to contribute 50% of the costs of the gazebo site as it's utilized by the whole community, not just Gibraltar Bay residents, and as they had in the past participated at that level.

We've had community support, you know, in the Facebook groups.

I think there's been several emails that mayor and council would have received.

So we're we're feeling that the support for from the community is out there.

Next slide, please.

So the next steps forward here are for us, the main one is coming here tonight to talk to you and hopefully achieving that goal of that 50% of the total cost.

After that, so we still have several more steps to go.

It's quite a convoluted process, as I'm sure some of you might know.

Being if you're a member of Estrata, we have to call a special general meeting in which we have set a date now for January 7th.

And we have to have a resolution and present that to residents, which they have to vote on.

So first we have to have a quorum.

24 of the 72 residents have to be present either physically or by proxy.

And then there has to be a vote taken taken amongst those present for the resolution to be successful, it must pass by 75%.

So the other reason the gazebo committee went forward with only one option is if you have more than one option, you're just going to dilute the vote and divide the group.

So we chose to go forward with one option.

That was our mandate.

And that was the one recommended.

So that's what we put forward.

It was, it was, I would say the majority of people had lots of questions at that meeting, which we were able to answer.

And I think I would say personally that it was well received and that they did get the information that they were looking for.

And I feel the majority of the residents are on board, but until we have the vote, we we won't know that.

So, next slide.

So, just the future and the safety.

So, if we get our positive result, which we really hope we do at the special general meeting, we will go through with the final quotation process, including all the original contractors, to finalize the costs, and then we would proceed with the project as soon as possible.

If the root resolution does not pass, the gazebo will need to be removed and the area securely fenced off.

I see I'm out of but out of time.

The current state of the gazebo must be addressed as soon as possible to prevent safety and liability issues.

And just at the very end, next slide is just some AI generated visions for you that they're not totally accurate.

They're as good as we could get.

So that's what we're hoping we'd have a structure that looks similar to that.

Thank you very much for allowing me to present, and if I can answer any questions.

Yeah, thank you.

So normally our procedure uh for uh a presentation or delegation, as we don't get into a great debate, we'll ask you some questions, but we'll probably refer this to staff to have them bring back some options like uh if we were going to do it, where would the money come from, uh liability, all of those other things that we'd have to ask for.

But uh I think to uh fill in the blanks, we'd have a couple of questions.

So um right now, your quote or your ask of us is the half of fifty-one thousand thirty-six dollars, which to the town would be twenty-five thousand five hundred and eighteen.

That's the ask.

Yes, sir.

Um, and uh that is before detailed quotes, so correct?

It is, it is, it is.

So I I'm not sure the best way to handle that because you're answerable to two parties, you've got to convince your strata as well.

Uh so my next question would be um, is there a date set for your next general meeting that you'll you you would bring this proposal if View Royal was uh on board with uh with the half uh cost sharing?

Yes, the special general meeting date is set for January 7th.

January 7th.

Yeah.

Uh turn it to my colleagues if there's any other questions, Councillor Brown and then Councillor Rogers, please.

Just just a quick one.

So ongoing maintenance.

Who would be responsible for that?

Do you have a committee from your strata or how how is it how would that look?

We have maintained m the wooden structure mostly ourselves, the the strata.

But uh so I would think that we would continue to do that.

We have a lot landscape contractor, so I don't think that would be one of the other reasons to go the rock and cement structures.

We feel there wouldn't be the upkeep that we currently have now.

Thank you, Councilor Rogers.

Yes, uh thank you.

And and uh, you know, we went there this afternoon, and I think what struck me the most was um seeing the two residents uh that have walked all the way from Eltham.

Yes.

What a surprise, but it's a surprise to me, but probably not uh um to you, you know, the the folks that get to see it all the time.

So this is uh I think more than just the harbor.

And uh I I've talked to Clared and you know it's a um it's a very significant destination point for for the harbor folks.

Um you uh you mentioned the um um the current structure has been there for about 20 20 odd years.

And I guess the my question to staff, if I may, um the safety aspects, whether or not uh the current structure is uh to code, um and uh because I know that um we have to uh reassess our playground structures all the time and and find that um uh they're not to code anymore.

So is is I uh wonder if staff had a look at it and and assess the whether things are in code or not, meets code.

Uh Mary Tobias, um as the asset does not belong to the town, uh the town does not inspect the leg zero.

I guess the um well it you know, I appreciate it that's that may be the case, but uh there's so many of our residents in in the town that uh do enjoy the facility.

Okay, but that's um that answers my question.

But I think it's important to get uh further feedback from staff on this, and but I hope that we can get it in time for um the AGM from uh the strata council age meeting, special meeting.

Thank you.

Um uh I'll go to you Scott and see if we could get a report back from staff on this um would it be too much to ask that we have it before the Christmas break so they would have uh a response from the town on the seventh I I think we could certainly go down and have a look I've been there myself it's it's gorgeous and uh it's certainly an asset worth investigating so that would be part of the staff report um is is to do a quick assessment so uh counselor matsen counselor quellitage, uh have you questions for Councillor Matson?

No questions for me.

The um I like the idea of the report, so thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Matson.

So we will make a a uh a motion to refer this to staff for a report, uh, which I think they're gonna do anyway, but for the books, we'll do it.

Uh so can I have uh I'll move seconded.

Uh all those in favor?

Any opposed?

Seeing none opposed, so hopefully we'll get you an answer back uh before uh the Christmas break.

So then you can go into the seventh and and find out.

And feel free to stick along uh stick around for the rest of the council meeting.

I know it's gonna be action-packed, and you'd uh you'd not rather watch the uh American election results.

So thank you very much for your presentation.

Uh I think that brings us to public participation period.

Are is there anybody in the room that would like to address counsel on any topic at all?

Claire.

I live in View Royal.

Um I appreciate this opportunity to speak.

Um I'm here to comment on the Gibraltar Bay Gazebo issue.

Thank you very much for that excellent presentation.

Um I was left with one question when I looked at it online.

When you uh at the end it says something to the effect if um if you don't get the funding part from the town, that the area would be fenced off for safety.

I just wasn't clear what that means.

And so I came to say that the most important thing in my mind is that public access to that area is continued.

The property in question is a significant viewpoint, and that is what matters to me.

Also, um, I believe that the less infrastructure that is there, then the less desirable it is for attracting vandalism and or groups of people with potential noisy and or illegal activities.

I realize it's kind of complicated as there's a covenant on this common property within the strata, and it says a gazebo is to be there.

Regarding the covenant, I haven't had access to the wording, but in general, a covenant's a contract, and I hope council has provided and reads that actual covenant prior to making any decision on the matter.

Again, a significant viewpoint for the community is being considered here.

Safe with limited comfort seems adequate, and in keeping with other green spaces and viewpoints in the town, the bench and fencing are enough in my mind.

If view royal residents were to lose access to the property and the view where that gazebo is located now, that would be a sad day.

I do hope there's a satisfactory way forward for the strata and the town.

Thank you, Claire.

Thank you for your time.

Going once, twice, three times.

Carl, do we have any what do you call them now?

Chats?

Do we get any chats?

Uh Mayor Tobias, we have uh no messages in the chat system.

Okay, we'll call them messages from now on.

Uh uh thank you.

So I think that brings us to business arising from previous minutes.

And I think this was uh I'm on item 7A, and I'll turn this over to Councillor Brown.

Yeah, this is a motion I'd like to put on the floor, and hopefully I get a second or for discussion.

That the town of View Royal asked the Greater Victoria School District number 61 Board of Education to consider a trustee electoral area election model to be implemented in time for the 2026 local government board of education elections, and that the letters be sent to the uh participating municipalities.

We can take out Esquimel because they've already done this.

Um the last election we had 30 30 candidates running for uh school trustee and only one in uh View Royal, which is coincidentally the only one I voted for because it's the only one I I know.

Um I don't have children in the school, but I do have multiple grandchildren in District 61.

And I think by having an at-large election, uh we're missing out.

And and uh the school district's budget, it it dwarfs our budget.

It dwarfs the budgets of the other uh municipalities involved as well.

So uh we do have a vested interest, and it would be nice to have.

I mean, you can't force people to run from the town of View Royal, but it would be nice to have uh somebody uh and how they this is just a recommendation, a letter to them considerate, and the way they would divide it into zones or or wards would be up to them.

But uh, even if it was two divisions, but right now um people in Victoria and Oak Bay dominate that uh school board.

And not only do I have grandchildren in District 61, but also the school liaison program, which is near and dear to my heart, because I was a former school liaison officer myself.

Um and I I see these decisions being made, and I feel as a VRL resident, I have no input to the uh to the school board.

So they have nine trustees, and I like I say none of them are from View Royal, and it'd be nice to have some of these consider running from View Royal, or from if they divide it in half and maybe some from a squamold even because you know you get this big long list of 30 people, and who do you vote for?

Um it's ridiculous.

Uh uh like I said, I voted for one person, and he he has listened to Christie Point, and uh I voted for him, but um it'd be nice to have it divided up.

I know District 62 does it.

They have Mills Landing Zone and they have the Belmont zone.

So Souk and the Wannafuque electoral area is one zone, they have three trustees from there, and they have four from the Belmont zone.

And that seems to work quite well, especially around election time.

You'd have smaller ballots and and more interest.

And maybe that would help municipally as well uh to get a bigger turnout.

Thank you, Councilbrenn.

I'd be happy to uh second your motion just with one friendly amendment.

Is that do you want anything changed in in supporting a Squimalt's letter, or do we do we would just want this letter to cover that one that we were in support of the Squimalt's um request?

I think it just says printed, but we we can strike uh squamal out we don't have to advise them because they've already sent the letter but and perhaps the other municipalities may um do similar yeah I'd be happy to second that then uh councillor Brown uh any other questions for counselor brown counselor rogers yeah thank you I I certainly appreciate the idea I think what we're we're striving for is proportionate representation and um do you think that um by doing this though that we would be um it would necessitate um more trustees for school district sixty one it's it would be the same number.

Yeah, there's nine currently, and uh again it's just a letter asking them to consider it and uh how they formulate that would be up to them.

But no, I uh nine is the number now, and it's based on the number of students and number of schools.

Um uh district sixty two only has seven.

Uh when I was a trustee in Nanaimo, we had nine, but we didn't we did a at-large system and I represented uh Ladysmith area and Gabriel Island because we we we did that by assignment, but but people from Ladysmith now they felt kind of left out as well because they never or Gabriel Island, same thing.

Uh in that large election, what chance does someone from Gabriola Island, for example, have to get elected?

So um uh yeah, we did it by assignment, we didn't do it by wards, but district sixty-two did.

Councillor Qualitage, uh any questions?

No questions.

Thank you.

Councilor Matson?

Nothing.

Uh yeah, so we got a mover.

We got a seconder.

All those in favor of Councillor Brown's motion.

Any opposed?

Noting Councillor Qualitage opposes.

Um reports.

And I think this is over to staff for development variants permit for 498 Island Highway.

Thank you, Maritobias.

The purpose of this report is for council's consideration of development variance permit 2024-02 for 498 Island Highway.

The applicant has requested two variances.

Oh, uh, to replace an existing changeable copy sign with a new electronic changeable message sign with similar proportions and to increase the maximum height permitted of a wall sign from 4.5 meters to seven meters.

At the committee of the whole meeting on July 9th, the committee passed the following motion that the report dated July 2nd, 2024, from the community planner titled Development Variance Permit 202402.

For excuse me, that's supposed to be uh that's 498 Island Highway.

Um, be received for information.

During that meeting, the committee discussed the form and character of the proposed sign, the light pollution, location of the sign, and potential of a legal agreement.

At the time, staff did not support the proposed development variance application for the following reasons.

Proposed sign type was prohibited underneath the sign bylaw.

Only a handful of electronic changeable copy signs are currently in town, and the sign um differed from what's been around in that it would also include the potential for images or videos.

Concerns that the residents and the strata across the street, so behind the gas station, would experience light pollution at night from the sign.

And we wouldn't be able to really regulate the character size of the text in the messages simply because they'd have to go with really what they can see.

So just to give you kind of a visual of where the existing sign is and it's still a location for the proposed sign.

Since the initial application was brought forward, the applicant has provided some additional supporting information, which is an attachment one of this report.

The applicant has informed staff that the digital text-only type sign, such as a what we have at the fire department and/or the four-mile pub next door, is no longer on the market.

They've sinced replaced that technology to include signs that would allow for images as well.

Staff also discussed with the applicant the potential of moving the sign from where it was shown on the building to the existing freestanding sign that we all see at the corner of the road.

And unfortunately, the owners of the pub believed that the sign would be too low and uh potentially be like um in the way for people driving, so in the sight line triangle and/or potential for vandalism and would serve no effective purpose for what they were hoping to do, which was I guess have people view it further down the highway.

The applicant also had some concerns um in that it would just be easier with its current location.

Um, so it's possible to have the settings of the sign um changed, they're fully programmable, so the sign would automatically adjust to the brightness based off of ambient light, so whether it's late late at night or during the day.

It's also possible to set a timer so that the sign would turn off at a certain time.

Uh transition times between messages or and andor images can be set.

Um similar permits have set a time frame of 30 seconds per message or image, so that we can do something similar here.

The size of the text could also be something programmable.

So the graphic on the screen is currently just an idea.

They could go much larger or much smaller with their text and images.

And the property owner has stated that they are willing to work with staff to ensure that the display settings are appropriate and would be willing to register a legal agreement on title to control the transition time between messages and/or the display brightness.

So at this time, staff is recommending that council authorize the issuance of the DVP with the following recommendation that development variance permit 2024 02 be approved as per the report dated October 29th, 2024 from the community planner titled Development Variance Permit 2022, 2024-02 Island Highway, 498 Island Highway, and that the following variances of the signed bylaw be included, replacing the existing changeable sign copy with an electrical sign copy and increasing the maximum height from 4.5 meters to seven meters.

Further, that the applicant works with the town to execute a legal agreement to restrict the electric changeable copy sign to have text to Android images for a minimum of 30 seconds and controlled the display brightness prior to the issuance of the development variance permit.

And that the applicant reimbursed the town for all legal costs in Zo.

There's probably a few questions.

And then the report also has the other options.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh we'll start with Councillor Brown.

Yeah, I like the electronic science, and uh I know Jimmy Pattison has a number of them around.

I just wonder if I had a really good relationship with the owner of Six Mile Pub and a come election time.

If I was to rent space, would that be contravening our bylaw?

Because I did spend a lot of money on a sign going to Starlight Stadium last time.

Cost me $1,500.

And it was uh uh to have 12 seconds every minute or something, 12 seconds every minute.

I kept on flashing my ugly mug on the big sign.

Uh, but it but it's that's in Langford.

So I just wonder if uh I had a good relationship, which I I think I do, uh, whether that would be contravening the our sign line or or or or could that be it's on private property.

So I mean I could put one of my ugly wooden signs somewhere on the corner if he'd let me do it, right?

The sign bylaw does have some rules regarding third party um marketing, I guess you can say on a property.

So we could use that as a mechanism.

Yeah, that's what I figured.

I know the mean people at Wall and Fukua Parks and Rec wouldn't let me use their sign.

So round counselor Brown, Counselor Quality.

I'll move staff recommendation.

Yeah, we're not through uh questions yet, but thanks, uh counselor Matthew.

Uh thank you.

And just for the record, I would never get sick of seeing your face on any sign.

I have a place for radio though.

Uh has was there any consideration to ICBC statistics in the area of six mile and island highway?

No.

Okay.

Um, for what it's worth, I'm certainly familiar with crash statistics in the CRD, and I can tell you that that's one of the highest rated uh intersections for collisions.

And I just think before we move forward, we should probably really consider how this will look.

Uh, for example, the whole purpose of a sign is to get people's attention.

I think it's fair to say that pedestrian volume is fairly low there in general, other than walking to the bus stop.

So um I just put that out there for consideration.

Something perhaps is quite quite significant decision point.

Councillor Rogers.

Yes, thank you.

I had a uh a problem on um being able to see in in figure two with the sign location, um, actually determining the size of the proposed sign in that image.

Um it if we kind of had an outline in yellow that you know how much because I can absolutely see the size of the one on uh the existing, I have no idea what that sign size is on the proposed.

So that's my question.

Do we have any way of knowing from that picture what sign that size sign that would be?

Um through the chair, the sign of sizes in the attachments.

Yeah, it's just visually, you know.

I would I appreciate the the visual on the um existing, but the proposed uh doesn't assist me in in uh understanding what um what the the end result would look like if it's uh if it's indeed passed.

My next uh, so yeah, I don't think we can do much there.

My next question is have we consulted with the residents of the uh 300 um um six mile, the strata that uh would be most directly impacted?

Because I was there uh this afternoon in their parking lot, and I got a really clear view of the six mile pub and the existing sign.

And so um I know that the applicant had said that it wouldn't be a problem that uh after 80 meters, but I was standing at 108, 114 meters, and I was clearly able to see it.

So my my worry, my question is um, much like we had concerns with the casino signs with those individuals up on top of the COHO, uh, they were um really unhappy with um uh what was being proposed, and I wonder if we're gonna get any negative feedback from the residents there if we haven't consulted with them.

Through the through the chair, as part of the development permit process, notices were sent out which would have included the residents at the 300 um six mile road strata um if they wanted to provide us with information they're welcome to do so now um during this meeting um we to date we haven't received anything to my knowledge so we did attempt to uh consult with the residents correct okay that's good okay um and I appreciate the details that you have in in the recommendation um so I guess when this if this is approved and when the sign is up, um if there are concerns with the residents at nighttime, Claire or whatever, um, will we be um still able to can be respectful, consider the uh the residents and um be able to bring down the brightness if they're so requested?

Through the chair, there'd have to be likely an amendment to the covenant once we discover or make a determination on which light ambience we want to use at night, for example.

So if it's too bright at that point, there could be a a look to amend it.

I'm not sure quite what that process would look like.

So I'm I'm didn't didn't quite hear that.

What um I I think she was saying we'd have to amend the process.

So it's not just turning it down.

We'd have to amend the kind of you know we won't know until um until that happens.

And I totally agree with the sign.

Uh if I may, Councillor Rogers, this question might help.

Is the proposed signage brighter than the current signage?

My assumption would be yes.

It it it would be brighter than the the current signage.

Okay.

At nighttime.

At nighttime, yeah.

Mm-hmm.

That's a worry.

Okay, uh, this part of this is gonna be handled a little bit like a hearing as opposed to normal staff um uh moving a staff recommendation.

So we'll hear from the applicant.

We'll also hear from uh the public um as well.

Um so any other questions, counselor rogers, before I go back to counselor brown.

No, thank you.

Just a couple of quick comments.

Uh I know several people live in the uh strata that uh councilor Rogers is talking about, and their power was out all day yesterday.

And fortunately the six mile was open.

So I guess the signs like I could see, well, it's open, we can go get something to eat or get warm because uh several people from there did go over the six mile and had something to eat and stayed warm because their power was out all day.

As far as traffic accidents go, I know that intersection very well, go through it multiple times in a day, gazillion times in a week.

Um, almost all the accidents are caused by people heading towards Victoria, turning left onto six mile road.

So they're the the signs behind them.

Or people pulling out of the shell station where they have two exits onto the highway, and that's one of the most dangerous corners there.

I've seen the accidents.

Almost all of them are caused by people turning left.

So that's just by two cents per.

Thank you, Councillor Brown.

I'll go to Counselor Mattson uh next if you've got any comments or questions for staff.

Uh my question is do we set are we setting a precedent with this sign?

I know it's new technology, it's kind of uh it's a slick commercial essentially that you're able to watch uh in small snippets.

So are we setting a bit of a precedent by allowing this one in and will everybody want a moving digital sign so we look like the Vegas strip through the chair there are other other covenants um similarly created in the town for like I said the time of messaging um 30 seconds it would be the property where the Burger King is located there's I think two there was a previous sign there I don't think it's there anymore but there was a covenant registered for the hunting and tackle I think it was the store um and as for the sign type, yes, this would be the first in View Royal.

Thank you uh councilor Matson, I want to give you an opportunity to provide any questions or comments.

Oh, it just seems like we've got a new sound type, sign type, but it's going to be used the way the old signs were.

I just don't see the the issue.

It's a small sign up and up high, and um I think we should be doing what we can to support the businesses in town.

And this doesn't seem like a big ask.

Thank you.

Uh Councilor Matson.

And I think we can move to comments from the applicant.

However, I do not know if they have joined.

Carl, have the applicants joined for agenda item eight one A.

Mayor Mayor Tobias, I'm just checking on that now.

Um no, they haven't, Mayor.

Okay, I think we can go down to comments from the public.

Is there anybody in the room that has an opinion about um the signage that they would like to express to council?

Seeing no opinions in the room.

Carl, do we get any chats from the public on the sign?

Um Mayor Tobias, nothing on the chat board so far this evening.

Okay, and uh staff just double checking for correspondence.

Do we have anything in correspondence on the sign?

I didn't see anything even in the late ads nothing okay um I think this is can I try with my motion now absolutely counselor matzon I want to uh endorse staff's motion to support I will check in for discussion uh and go ahead and motivate counselor mattson um I don't have too much more to add and for it's it's doesn't seem like a big ask um we have a lot of similar signs that in in terms of what they're gonna be able to show the public um plus again if the uh if this business thinks it's going to help them I don't see that it's I I anyways I just can't see any problem so based on that unless I hear some convincing argument I will be supporting the motion thank you councillor Rogers thank you um yeah I I uh I like what staff's um you know provided us um I understand that's a better location than having a freestanding sign which would be closer to the um uh to the residents uh um on six mile.

My concern is that um uh we're moving from uh a sign that we can obviously see the size size of, it's static.

And the if we're now told that it's gonna be larger, brighter, it's not gonna be brighter.

It's not going to be larger.

It's the same size.

So is it going to be the same lumens brightness?

The light the brightness will be probably brighter, however, it the sign sign itself is the exact same footprint as the existing sign.

Okay.

It it's still there's still a level of uncertainty for me.

Um in terms of like I say, you know, if it if it is going to be brighter, it's gonna be dynamic and it's gonna be larger.

And um that's well, residents at 306 mile might get a piece of paper.

They really haven't, I don't think, understood what this may do, and and maybe they they would be happy for it and have no objections.

But I have to err on the side of caution and vote against this because we will have no recourse if it's installed and they don't like it.

Thank you.

I've got a question for staff.

Um is it possible to put in a time limit for review on this variance?

Is it possible to say that we're willing to trial it for a year?

And if there's no issues with it, then we would they would carry on as normal.

If there is an issue with it, we could we would revisit it.

Through the mayor, uh no, there's there's not that opportunity in a through a development variance permit.

It's either council approves the variance or not.

Uh staff is recommending that there's a legal agreement registered on title to control the brightness and the time between the changeable, but that's basically how as far as we can go.

Okay, thank you.

Councilor Brown.

Sorry, another comment.

Something that's really distracting is watching a 17-year-old kid climbing on a big ladder, uh half physically changing the sign.

So uh it'd be nice to see that old sign gone.

I think it'd be improvement, it'd be improvement for the building.

Um I I think perhaps people might be more happy with it if there was a time limit for them to rather than having it running 24 hours a day.

I don't know what's the what would be the purpose of them having the sign displayed out two o'clock in the morning after closing time.

So uh that's just something that might be a consideration.

Thank you, Councillor Brown.

Uh there are any other questions or comments.

Counselor.

Just it it's really unfortunate the applicant isn't here to help guide us and and give us more information.

Um uh so that's um uh another uh reason that I have to err on this item of my caution because he's not here.

Maybe he would be able to align my fears and concerns, and and maybe we'd um you know we'd have an opportunity.

I will certainly go to 300 six mile and knock on the door of those folks and see if they're happy with it.

But um at this moment I couldn't determine the brightness or the size based on the information I had.

If there's no other questions or comments, then uh we've got a mover and a seconder.

It's not really for discussion.

You are the seconder.

Um so all those in favor of uh the staff recommendation, all those opposed to the staff recommendation.

So councillor uh Rogers and Councillor Qualitic were opposed.

Um the motion carries three, two.

Thanks, Steph.

I think that brings us to uh committee of the whole resolutions and eight three.

We've got uh two reports to receive.

Can I get a motion to receive, or does anybody want to pull one out and talk about one of those?

Um move a seat and I just want to make a quick comment uh question for the uh West Shore Parks in RAC second receive.

So a quick question.

Um the um this the extraordinary success of the friday night uh youth programs um you know the uh somehow i got the impression that there may be some level of uncertainty of continuing the program um through funding have we got any more certainty of that um since our last meeting yeah thanks for bringing that up this has been something that we've been considering strongly for the past uh few meetings and it will result in some extraordinary costs uh from the municipalities we do have support.

Uh, there were certain levels, John, that we could choose from um how we host the night involving security, uh, providing some food at a discounted rate for from from the vendors at a discounted rate and complimentary to the youth to bring them in, uh, various levels of uh uh staff guiding the youth there for for sports and swimming.

Um, we have settled on an option that I believe uh will be coming back to us for a resolution the next our next meeting, which is uh which is soon.

And uh we are there is general support for it.

John, we really believe that this is a really important program.

We don't offer many of the municipalities, well, all of the municipalities don't offer really a youth uh night.

And uh those of us who have been in in the criminal justice field or public safety field, government, we know that having an outlet for these kids is just critical.

Uh a place where they can go and gather that's not uh a parking lot or a 7-Eleven.

And we just think there's really good value there and really good ROI.

Thank you.

And and you know in reflection that's really great news, in reflection of all this, uh one of the things that um um dawned on me was uh the poor level of transit service for view o youth to be able to get to West Shore.

I'm thinking those that would be um like along Admirals, um Glen uh Glen Early Contana, um, because the the the bus, the the 46th bus has terrible service and probably no nighttime service.

So the ability for our youth to get to the West Shore is probably something we have to think about and and uh lobby uh uh transit to um um step up and and help those youth.

But just to continue that on, and I know you've been a strong advocate for a seat on the transit commission, and we've been uh ignored uh for years.

And you bring up a good point because if you want these young folks to get to these destinations, you have to provide them adequate transportation.

And to your point, there are many pockets of URL where it's just it's really not feasible for them to get there and to get home.

Uh it's dark and uh etc.

So um you raise some really excellent points.

So we've got a mover and a seconder to receive the committee the whole resolutions.

All those in favor, receipt.

Any opposed, seeing none opposed.

Uh we have uh for action.

Well look at my staff list uh for item A.

Uh the West Shore mayors have um met and discussed the uh uh letter withdraw.

Um and we are also meeting with Sergeant or Superintendent Preston uh this Friday afternoon uh to have a discussion about it.

Uh it was mainly to coordinate kind of that because at the same time some of these service withdraws came in.

Um all of our municipalities on the west shore were advocating funding stabilization for some of the programs.

So we'll have that discussion.

I'll have more to report back to council on that.

Um there's a number of other uh letters here mainly in support of the Gazimo is there anybody that wants to pull one out yeah I move a sheet of um a two a2f including the new um the the late uh additions uh do you have seconder counselor brown will second all those in favor of receipts.

Any opposed?

Seeing none opposed.

Motion carries for receipt.

Uh household sewer grinder pump transfer to owner update.

I'll pass this one to Ivan.

Is this one yours?

Uh yes, Mary Tobias, it is.

Thank you.

Um, so uh well it's two parts, so this is just a staff report uh and then the bylaws afterwards.

So uh the purpose of this report is to give council uh just a quick background on our sewer grinder pump update.

So we have around 16 grand pumps that we maintain.

It was basically grandfather since incorporation, and through time we do uh are allowed to take these off the list.

So um some examples are if there's a change in property ownership, uh, we're allowed to um have the homeowners start to own and maintain them, uh, which is good for the town um as it reduces our operational impact.

So we found out that there's two properties that have changed ownership, and so the purpose of this report is to identify them and to recommend the council to um uh approve the bylaw, the subsequent bylaw, um, which is reduction from 16 properties to 14 properties.

And Ivan, just a quick question.

These were uh put in how long ago?

Uh Mayor Tobias, that's a good question.

The 70s and 80s around there, I think the reports.

So those those were some of the initial get-off septic go on to uh main sewers.

So the grinder pumps were to essentially push it uphill um to get to where it goes.

And the town, I guess before it was a town, um was a district was in charge of maintaining those to get everybody onto a sewer main, I'm assuming.

Mayor Tobias, that is correct.

The Capital Regional District uh maintained and owned the system.

And uh grinder pumps pumping uphill, you're exactly right.

It's a cheaper way of conveying sewers.

Otherwise, if things are to be gravity, you'd have to have the pipes very, very, very deep.

So cost-effective solution, um, albeit the um it does require more maintenance.

Thanks, Ivan.

Uh Councilor Rogers.

Yes, thank you.

Great report.

Um, do you do you have a sense of how much an annual cost might be to um maintain uh I guess now 14 residents every year?

Uh yeah, Mayor Tobias.

Um I don't have a number at the top of my head.

I do know that uh each property is uh the staff do do at least annual maintenance, so at least once or twice a year to test the grinder pumps out, and then uh uh staff and the and the maintenance team also do call outs.

So in the case of the pump's not working or something's broken and needs to be replaced, uh that also requires a call out.

Councilor Brown.

Sorry, a little little bit off topic, but that's just a question for you, uh Director of Engineering.

The people, when they appeal their their sewage bills, which people just got recently, I'm gonna rule that out of order.

Okay, I just want to know how long how long this turnaround period is for appeals.

Yeah, we'll rule that one out of order and stick with the sorry, counselor Brown.

Um and any other questions related to the sewer pumps?

Move the senior staff report.

Uh do we have secondary?

Second.

All those in favor of receiving the staff report.

Any opposed?

Seeing none opposed.

Now we get down to the bylaw item.

I move first through third about law 1151.

Second.

Seconded by Councillor Mattson.

Uh any motivation?

Discussion?

All those in favor?

Any opposed?

Seeing none opposed, uh readings first through third, uh Carrie.

Thanks, Ivan.

Uh no new business.

Uh this brings us to question period.

Anybody in the room with a question?

Donna, you're already up there.

I I have a question, I don't know whether it's appropriate or not, but um I see uh contractors in the neighborhood doing work and I'm wondering if there's any oversight of the quality of the work that is being done.

We at the corner of View Royal and Stewart, we had a big hole in the road for most of well, all of the summer with cones around it.

They finally came about a few weeks ago and sat at the side of the road all one morning, and then eventually somebody put down some asphalt around noonish and created a gigantic puddle right in front of a drain.

And you know, are we skimping on asphalt so that we cannot grade towards the um drain?

That's huge.

Why do we accept this kind of shoddy workmanship when we're paying for it?

And is anybody um charged with the responsibility to see that these things are done in a satisfactory manner?

And I and another bone is the uh quality of the weeding that's done in the median on the four-mile hill.

I'm convinced they pull the top off a weed so that the root sprouts up again in two weeks they can come back and play around there.

Um I would be quite happy to go out with my trowel and dig it up, and you probably only have to um pay me a very small fraction of what you pay Victor A contracting.

And that's my beef for tonight because I'm too afraid to go home and see what's going on south.

And I did the two minutes.

Thank you.

Uh do I get an answer to my question?

Yeah, I think we could we could.

I think there is somebody rather responsible somewhere down the line on both those things, but Ivan, I'd assume ultimately it would be you or maybe even Scott.

Uh, but uh for quality uh assurance for when a job is complete, you probably got a uh both for the routine stuff and for the exceptional, you've got a a uh quality control mechanism in place.

Uh Mary Divis, we do, and specifically that project, if the if the questionnaire wishes to contact us at engineering at vrl.ca or directly ileung at vrol.ca, we can certainly uh follow up.

So no motions or notices of uh motion, but I think I'm going to prompt you, Councillor Rogers, uh, for a notice of of a motion, maybe for the next meeting, uh, on uh a letter of advocacy for increased um services to the West Shore uh along that.

I'd be happy to make the notice of motion for that.

Yes, to increase the uh lobby at BC Transit to um Victoria Transit to have improved services from V World to uh the West Shore box and rack.

Yeah, I'd be happy to put that notion motion forward.

Thank you.

I think that brings us to a closed meeting resolution, Sarah.

It does.

Thank you.

There's a need to have a meeting closed to the public and persons other than the immediate members of council, officers and employees of the town, and those identified under section 91 subsection two of the community charter shall be excluded on the basis of section 90 Subsection 1A appointment.