Attachment #1: Resident Correspondence (17 responses) - Six Mile Road 4-Way Stop
Letters from residents reporting frequent stop sign violations and recommending safety improvements like flashing lights.
Attachment #1
Six Mile Road/Chilco/Nursery Hill Intersection
New 4-Way Stop
Resident Correspondence (17 responses)
From: Judy Estrin
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 3:18 PM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: New design at 6 Mile Road and Chilco
Good afternoon,
I am disheartened to see that a protected left turn lane has been removed from 6 Mile into Chilco. There is no alternate route into e development and having a protected lane gave me more of a safe feeling with the traffic flow from the highway and traveling towards Thetis and the highway.
I’m equally dismayed that they is now an obstruction on Chilco where a left turn lane once existed onto 6 Mile. It will now be even one difficult to navigate off of Chilco in any direction onto 6 Mile. I wonder how the fire department feels about the new obstruction on Chilco.
Then there is the growing level of graffiti in the area that doesn’t appear to have anyone addressing it.
So disappointed in my township.
Best regards,
Judy Estrin
2422 Lund Road
From: Jamie Delaney
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2021 7:54 PM
To: Mayor And Council Email mayorandcouncil@viewroyal.ca
Subject: 4 Way Stop @ Nursery Hill Dr and Six Mile RD
When I saw earlier this week that the lines were being changed/repainted I was curious. Would we FINALLY get some desperately needed street parking? It was extremely disappointing to see that, no, instead of extending street parking we put in a boulevard. What a wasted opportunity. Now that I see the intersection has been converted to a 4 way stop I am absolutely dumbfounded. This was a perfectly fine intersection which allowed traffic to flow. If traffic was becoming too heavy in the area then we needed traffic lights not a four way stop. At taxpayer expense we have installed a traffic nightmare. Good Job!
From: Ryan Cartmell
Sent: Monday, June 28, 2021 7:09 AM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Six Mile Road
Hello,
My name is Ryan Cartmell, and I reside at 24 Bamford Court. I'm sure I'm not the first email you're receiving about the new four way stop on Six Mile. And I'm not going to start giving my opinion of what I think of this change. But, something more has to be done for a short time before someone is killed. I personally on two occasions watched people try to cross the street on Six Mile only to nearly dive off the road so they didn't get run over. This morning, at 06:20, I sat at the stop sign waiting to turn right only to watch three vehicles from one direction and two from the other drive through without even considering to stop.
I realize it can take time for people to adjust and the temporary signage warning should be sufficient, but it clearly isn't working.
I don't want to see anyone get seriously hurt but from what I see it's inevitable. Perhaps some flaggers or law inforcement need to be present for the short term to try rectify this issue.
Pleas feel free to contact me if you require any further information.
Ryan Cartmell
From: Terra
Sent: Monday, June 28, 2021 6:21 AM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: 4-way stop at Chilco & 6-Mile
Hey there,
I’m sure I’m not the first to report this but this brand new 4-way stop is already causing some chaos — drivers on Six Mile Rd are just blowing through the intersection, completely oblivious to the new stop signs. I’m sure it’ll take a while for us all to adjust but maybe we need some flashing signs as a warning for now?
Thanks
~ Terra
From: smillarwstar
Sent: July 10, 2021 10:22 AM
To: Info Address info@viewroyal.ca
Subject: New Four Way Stop
Good Morning,
I live on Nursery Hill Drive and wanted to note issues of concern regarding the new four way stop at 6-Mile Road. There is a large sign warning of the new stop as you drive towards Thetis Lake but nothing for traffic coming off the ramp from the highway as you travel towards the 6-Mile Pub.
I have now seen three vehicles go right through the intersection including a dump truck. The vehicles did not pause in any way and in all three cases, it was just plain luck that there was not a serious accident.
If it is possible, I think another warning sign needs to be installed. It seems to be just a matter of time before a significant accident takes place.
Thank you for your consideration.
Sincerely,
Steve Millar
From: Jon Middleton
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2021 11:36 AM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: dangerous new intersection
Hello there,
I am citizen of Victoria but would like to bring to your attention what I deem to be a dangerous intersection in Colwood/Langford. It is a new 4 way stop at the intersection of Six Mile Rd, Chilco Rd and Nursery Hill Dr.
I received a ticket for running the stop sign the other day and I was bewildered and baffled as to how I could have missed this stop sign, even with it being a new 4 way and having been used to not having to stop at this intersection. So the next day, I went down and noticed that cars are parked all along the side of the road and are blocking the signs (see attached photos). I will be disputing the ticket based on this, but more worriedly, I believe that this intersection could lead to some accidents if this issue is not fixed.
To be more clear, the first photo is of a SUP businesses vehicle (the business is located across the road) mostly blocking the first large warning sign for the new intersection. More importantly, in the second photo (zoomed in) you will see that a larger canopy style work mobile is fully blocking the stop sign from view, even from view when right at the intersection.
Thank you for your time!
Jon Middleton
From: Neil Carfra
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2021 9:02 PM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Cc: Mayor And Council Email mayorandcouncil@viewroyal.ca; westshore@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
Subject: Intersection at 6 Mile Rd and Nursery Hill/Chilco
Good evening,
I am writing on behalf of The Owners, Strata Plan EPS 1080 (Thetis Edge). We're located at 150 and 170 Nursery Hill Drive. Owners here - myself included - are very concerned about safety at the new four way stop at the intersection of 6 Mile Rd and Nursery Hill/Chilco. A shocking number of drivers along both directions of 6 Mile are failing to stop. What is worse, I have seen too many near misses involving pedestrians crossing 6 Mile Road within the crosswalks by drivers who somehow fail to see them.
I see that the Town has eliminated the pedestrian-activated crossing signals and ground-off the crossing stripes within the original crosswalk. While I trust there was deliberation and a good reason for eliminating these safety features, I ask that they be reinstated. My sense is that drivers are on 'autopilot' and none of the several signs advising of a change in traffic pattern leading to these stops are registering. That's no excuse for such drivers but will be of no comfort to anyone hit in the crosswalk.
What I think would make even more sense is that there be flashing red lights st the intersection or around the stop signs themselves.
In the meantime, we applaud enforcement steps in the form of police cars attending regularly since the four-way went in. I've not seen one of them have to wait even five minutes before a driver fails to stop.
Sincerely,
Neil Carfra, strata vice president
202-150 Nursery Hill Drive
From: Karen Ryman
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2021 8:58 AM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: 4 Way Stop Six Mile Road
Good Day,
I previously received an email telling me a round about was going in on Six Mile Road and there has been a 4 way stop installed instead.
Six Mile Road is a major attery coming from both the Trans Canada Highway and Old Island Highway. Round Abouts are 20% more effective with the traffic flow and less vehicle accidents.
In September with the return to work from Covid and summer holidays this will cause a major back up of traffic on both the Trans Canada and Old Island Highway.
Can you please explain why the 4 way stop was installed vs the round about. There has been endless screetching of brakes and near accidents to date.
Regards,
Karen Ryman
From: Jean-Francois Dufour
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 11:04 AM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca; Mayor And Council Email mayorandcouncil@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Stop at Chilco Rd and Six Mile Rd
Good morning to whom it may concern,
With all due respect, the new 4 way Stop sign at the intersection of Chilco Rd and Six Mile Rd is a real pain in all directions now.
It really interferes with the fluidity of the traffic in all directions pretty much at all times of the day.
Moreover, it is hideous in the context of the neighbourhood.
I would like to suggest replacing the 4 way Stop by roundabouts. At least one at the intersection of Chilco Rd and Six Mile Rd. Optionally another could be put at the intersection of Atkins Rd and Six Mile Rd.
Roundabouts are used everywhere in Europe and more and more here in North america. Langford has many of them. They work super well in managing traffic in all directions and reducing and controlling speed. Their centers provide green spaces that can be beautifully landscaped, which also helps reduce traffic speed by creating a natural visual barrier for upcoming vehicles and reduces driver stress through their natural beauty. See picture attached.
Please strongly consider,
Jean-Francois Dufour
From: Jean-Francois Dufour
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2021 1:01 PM
To: Alex Heimburger aheimburger@viewroyal.ca; Mayor And Council Email mayorandcouncil@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Re: Stop at Chilco Rd and Six Mile Rd
Good day Alex,
In response to your response:
"Regarding your suggestion for roundabouts along Six Mile Road, the Town is currently in the design stages of implementing a roundabout along this roadway. [Excellent] The location will be at Six Mile Road and Atkins Road where the traffic has significantly higher volumes. [Atkins and Chilco being 80 meters apart, and the traffic volume mainly coming from the trans highway and highland highway, and the new project by Thetis lake, both Chilco Rd-Six Mile Rd intersection and Atkins Rd-Six Mile Rd intersection should have substantially the same traffic volume, so there is no reason other than cost for one intersection to have a 4 way Stop and the other intersection to have a roundabout, if both are equally effective and safe]
As with all municipal decision-making, the decision to install a 4 way stop at Six Mile Road and Chilco Road was about balancing cost, effectiveness and safety. [Roundabouts perfectly balance effectiveness and safety] The 4 way stop is approximately 20x cheaper than a roundabout [Are we really there in View Royal? Seriously?], and is preferred by residents [Yeah I heard about those handfull residents on Nursery Hill Dr who like to see the stop and go traffic by their living room window] over the straight through movement [Preferred over straight through by not preferred over a roundabout] as it does slow vehicles down. [Roundabouts slow down vehicles too but without stopping them thus creating traffic congestion]
Once road users are used to the change,[How many times I heard that in various situations] it will be safer for all concerned.
In 2018, the Town underwent a significant public engagement process concerning the Six Mile Corridor. The 4 way stop at Chilco Road and the roundabout at Atkins Road were two of the projects that were listed for improvements in the corridor amongst other improvements that have taken place and will continue to take place in the future. The Corridor Study may be seen on our website HERE
I Hope that this helps to answer your concerns."
Since I never complain without suggesting, I would like to suggest the following. Since the "cost" of two roundabouts seem to be View Royal's main issue here, why not remove the 4 way stops and install 2 temporary roundabouts (ie: on at Chilco Rd-Six Mile Rd and one at Atkins Rd-Six Mile Rd) and see how it does for the next year?
This solution is not "costly" and moreover View Royal will save itself the cost of a roundabout at Atkins Rd-Six Mile Rd in case it does not work.
Although I am sure two roundabouts will work wonders.
I invite you to Google: temporary roundabouts" for some ideas on how to set them up. There are many options.
Jean-Francois Dufour
From: Kalen Thorne
Sent: August 5, 2021 9:37 PM
To: mayorandcouncil@vieweoyal.ca; Engineering E@viewroyal.ca; View Royal Planning planning@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Chilco / Six Mille Road 4 way stop
Hello all,
I am writing to say that since the four way stop has been put in and the pedestrian light removed I have personally witnessed 3 vehicles run through this intersection. All three times I have been walking to cross Six Mille Road.
This evening I was crossing Six Mille Road to get to our condo building. As I stopped at the cross walk I watched and waited for the vehicle coming down the hill to stop before entering the cross walk. The car stopped. As I looked to my right right the vehicle coming up Six Mille Road was not slowing down. It did not slow down and seemed to be full speed as they ran the stop sign. I waved my arms holding up 4 fingers. The driver seemed unphased as they drove through the intersection.
We have enjoyed living at 170 Nursery Hill Drive for the past year we love the neighbourhood, location, Thetis Lake and our building. However, this intersection has been a down side and has now become even more worrisome to us. Anytime we have had guests to our condo or friends stay with us we have had to seriously warn them about the intersection.
Between my wife and I, we take our four year old daughter almost daily across this intersection to the lovely park in the neighborhood and it has become a very tense and unsafe experience. My concern is amplified by the fact that there are so many families, kids, dogs, who are out walking, biking, scootering, etc. who end up needing to use this crosswalk.
While I think the pedestrian flashing lights that were in place prior to the four way stop seemed somewhat safer, I do not know what the answer is to this issue, but I do hope you consider this concern as this problem could certainly be fatal.
Sincerely,
Kalen Thorne
From: [Redacted]
Date: August 10, 2021 at 11:44:45 AM PDT
To: David Screech MayorScreech@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Report a Problem / Safety Concern: Nursery Hill Drive & Six Mile Road Intersection
Hi,
I hope you are well. You will have to forgive me if I am emailing the wrong person for this ‘complaint’, but I figured that here would be a good (and traditional) place to start!
For quick background, I recently purchased a condo at 101 Nursery Hill Drive, where my unit [redacted] overlooking the intersection of Nursery Hill Drive and Six Mile Road. When we closed on the purchase, there was no four-way stop sign at this intersection, which I had understood at the time that View Royal was considering various options for traffic flow. Since our purchase, a new four-way stop has been installed, and well… living here the past month, I can say that I have a clear ‘birds-eye’ view of the effectiveness (and safety) of this choice and it is quite alarming.
For ease, I’ve chosen to itemize some brief observations and potential solutions, which I hope can help assist measures to enhance safety, traffic flow, noise levels, and general effectiveness of this intersection. I hope they may assist in some minor (and hopefully cost-effective) improvements.
Problems @ the Intersection of Nursery Hill Drive & Six Mile Road
- At least once every hour, somebody runs the stop sign.
[Redacted] the intersection, and I can say with certainty at least once every hour, a car fully runs the stop sign. This is evidenced by loud honking, shouting, road rage incidents, and tire ’squeals’. I have not seen anybody hit by a car, nor have I personally witnessed an accident. But, I do fear that it is a matter of time. I think signage is adequate - though, it is clear that drivers either aren’t paying attention, or, there is some sort of preventative barrier to realization. - Most vehicles are not fully stopping at the stop sign.
Further to the above, nearly every vehicle ‘rolls through’ the stop signs. This might be partial cause for the multiple occurrences of honking and road rage incidents daily, but it also poses a safety risk in and of itself. - Noise levels have risen exponentially in my building since the instalment of the four-way.
In addition to honks, road rage incidents, and screeching, engine noise / burnouts / aggressive driving has significantly reduced the quality of life in my unit. I can’t be certain that others facing other directions are equally affected, but traffic noise levels are much higher than would be with alternative arrangements. I can’t help but wonder if an alternative (or no solution) would have been more desirable, combined with #1 and #2 above. However, I do understand the importance of traffic safety and management. - During peak hours, traffic patterns seem to be worsened by the four way.
I read the report discussing options and impacts on traffic flow vs. cost, however, visibly and experientially, I am of the belief that the four-way stop considerably slows traffic in the area (coming off and going onto the highways) during peak hours. As I did not live here prior, I cannot say with certainty whether the four-way has contributed, but the traffic ‘back up’ appears considerable. I can’t help but wonder whether alternatives would have been more effective, but I trust that your staff had adequately researched such options.
Potential Suggestions or Solutions
- Have an officer periodically patrol the intersection to reduce problems #1 and #2.
I am not one for dramatics, but I do worry somebody will be severely injured
From: Kalen Thorne
Sent: August 11, 2021 8:35 PM
To: Alex Heimburger aheimburger@viewroyal.ca; Mayor And Council Email mayorandcouncil@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Re: Chilco / Six Mille Road 4 way stop
Hello Alex Heimburger, Council and Mayor,
Thank you for your response, although given the response, I now have many more questions.
Since sending my original email, I have witnessed another person walking their dog trying to cross Six Mille Road and experienced a car running the stop sign as the pedestrian should have been crossing. I have also experienced vehicles who do stop but then roll up toward the pedestrians while they are crossing.
My first question is when “balancing cost, effectiveness and safety” does this refer to the cost of the stop signs vs street lights? Or does this consider the cost of potential injury or fatality if a pedestrian is hit in this intersection?
It is good to know that residents were able to participate in the decision making, how many people participated? Is there a percentage of participation that is considered to be representative of the whole town? Was that number met? What were the demographics of participants? Were the participants those who use this cross walk daily with their children and pets? Personally, I would have also preferred a four way stop to the pedestrian crossing light prior to change and I would have been wrong.
Thirdly, what does it mean when “the town considered the issue of motorists adjusting to the intersection changes”? If I have just in normal daily use of the intersection witnessed four people completely run the stop sign, how many people have not adjusted since June 25th?
Could you also share more information on “regulated safety standards”? I understand the need for theory in making these decisions but practically, this intersection is not safe. If the stop signs are above safety standards then perhaps safety standards need to be re-considered.
Sincerely,
Kalen Thorne
From: Margaret Spark
Sent: August 19, 2021 12:57 PM
To: Engineering E@viewroyal.ca
Subject: Concern re New Stop Sign
Dear Sir/Madam:-
During the evening of Saturday, August 14th, 2021, the three occupants of our car witnessed two different episodes of vehicles failing to stop at the newly installed four-way STOP sign at the junction of Six Mile Road and Chilco Road. The first incident was whilst travelling on 6-Mile Road preparatory to joining the Trans-Canada Highway between 6:00pm and 6:15pm; the second incident occurred while we were returning on the same route, after exiting the Trans-Canada, again at the intersection with Chilco Road and Six Mile Road, at approximately 8:50pm. Thankfully, two potential accidents were avoided, but it sure was a near-miss.
I have observed that when new STOP signs are installed on other roadways on Southern Vancouver island, a flashing light or other prominent signs alert motorists to this traffic control change or addition. I would strongly urge your Engineering Department to install effective warning signs to ensure better road safety at this location.
I would appreciate the courtesy of a reply from you, please.
Respectfully, Margaret Spark
Victoria, British Columbia.
From: Aimee Klassen
Sent: August 20, 2021 9:53 AM
To: Info Address info@viewroyal.ca
Subject: 4 Way Stop-Nursery Hill
Good morning,
Recently there was a traffic pattern change and the town of View Royal installed a four-way traffic stop at the intersection of Nursery Hill Drive and Six Mile Road.
Since that time my partner and I have experienced 8-10 instances of people running through the 4 way resulting in extremely close calls for accidents. Many times watching people sail through the intersection at a high rate of speed.
While I appreciate that you have tried to gain people’s attention with the stop signs, it’s being missed quite a lot. I please consider urgently installing a light fixture to indicate a four way as this is quite a dangerous intersection now.
Aimee Klassen
Resident of Nursery Hill Drive
Topic: Streets and Sidewalks
Name: Lilly Luk
Address: 102 - 150 Nursery Hill drive
Message:
The new 4 way stop at Nursery Hill Drive and 6- mile Ave. Is DANGEROUS and a nuisance. My suite faces directly on 6 Mile where that 4-way is, and numerous times a day I can see people driving at high speed through the stop signs. I am worried a pedestrian will be struck at some point because there are no crossing lights for the crosswalks anymore. In addition, the excessive honking is such a disturbance to my sleep as I work shift work and sometimes am sleeping through the day time.
Topic: Streets and Sidewalks
Name: Jenn Devesa
Address: 115 Thetis Vale Crescent, Victoria, BC
Message:
Hi there,
Just wanted to report a major safety concern that has been occurring throughout the summer on a regular basis. A four-way stop was put in place at the intersection of Six Mile Road/Chilco Road/Nursery Hill Drive near the beginning of the summer. Numerous tactics to alert the public to this change including large signage and digital display boards have been in use during the summer but drivers moving up and down Six Mile road continue to drive right through the intersection, failing to abide by the 4-way stop. Whether I am doing a neighbourhood walk in the evening or returning home after running errands, I continue to observe people failing to stop. I am not out there recording at the intersection, but in my comings and goings alone there were 2 people yesterday (Sept 4) and a bus the day before. I have emailed BC transit regarding the bus but needed to share my concerns with someone else. With back-to-school this coming week, this will be a heavily used crosswalk and I am extremely concerned for the safety of the kids using the crosswalk to get to school. This has been happening for 2 months and I donâ?Tt see it happening any less than the start of the summer. I am hoping that back-to-school traffic will slow that corridor to make it safer, but that is far from a guarantee. My kids will be using the Galloping Goose trail to cross over the Six Mile Road but not everyone will do that as it adds to the morning walk. I donâ?Tt know what else can be done but I donâ?Tt want a child(or anyone) to be injured or killed before further change is enacted.
Thank-you for taking the time to read through my concerns,
Jenn Devesa
